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Posts: 331 | Location (where you live): TIMOR-LESTE | Registered: 16 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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And this is the legal opinion of the Government of the United Kingdom as expressed to the House of Lords by the Minister

http://www.publications.parlia.../text/90304w0004.htm

quote:
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath: Under the terms of Article VIII of the International Convention on the Regulation of Whaling, Japan's lethal research takes of minke whales in the Southern Ocean and of minke, Bryde's, sei and sperm whales in the North Pacific are, regrettably, quite legal.
quote:
The right of any contracting Government to the International Whaling Commission (IWC) to issue special permits and to conduct lethal research whaling is enshrined in Article VIII of the International Convention on the Regulation of Whaling (ICRW). The chairs' suggestions do not include any proposal to amend Article VIII. The extent to which current so-called scientific whaling may or may not be curtailed as a result of pursuing any of the options advanced in the chairs' paper will depend on the willingness of those Governments currently pursuing such operations to scale them back voluntarily, in exchange for other possible concessions. There would be no legal recourse for the IWC if such voluntary action were ever discontinued.
quote:
Save through an amendment to Article VIII of the International Convention on the Regulation of Whaling (which would probably require the convening of a formal diplomatic conference to adopt it and subsequent ratification by all parties to bring it into effect), the International Whaling Commission has no power to alter the legal status of whaling under special permit


Clearly, just like Japan, other countries do not recognize these waters as Australian.

And clearly the Japanese whaling is legal.
 
Posts: 331 | Location (where you live): TIMOR-LESTE | Registered: 16 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Nobody hunts whales in the US, Why?


Actually they do.

The US government gives permits under the ICRW for whaling by native coastal tribes. Japan supports this action in the IWC but the US does not reciprocate with regards to Japan's own coastal communities.
 
Posts: 331 | Location (where you live): TIMOR-LESTE | Registered: 16 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Your right,
I was going to mention the native tribes. But I was refering to anyone outside our borders to hunt whales here. So I didn't think I needed to.
I thought is was obvious, sorry.
 
Posts: 346 | Location (where you live): UNITED STATES | Registered: 24 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by agni99:
This is Justice Alsop's ruling

http://www.hsi.org.au/editor/a...vs_Kyodo_FCA_664.pdf


Thanks! I just finished reading the Melbourne University interview with Charles Schencking. Interesting.

I checked his bio both at Melbourne University and Hong Kong University. His field of expertise is in Japanese History for which he received his PhD. I looked at all his published articles and I can find no article by him on the Antarctic Treaty or on the UNCLOS outside this interview.

While I do accept him as an expert on Japanese culture and history, I do not accept him as an expert on the Antarctic Treaty or the UNCLOS. He is not an expert in either the Treaty or the UNCLOS. My interpretation is just as valid as his.


"A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." - Mark Twain
 
Posts: 403 | Location (where you live): UNITED STATES | Registered: 13 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Did you notice what The Attorney General of Australia submitted to Justice Alsop regarding the Australian EEZ claim?

quote:
First, the Government considers that the Government of Japan would regard any attempt by Australia to enforce Australian law against Japanese vessels and its nationals in the Antarctic EEZ to be a breach of international law on Australia’s part and would give rise to an international disagreement with Japan.

Secondly, enforcement of Australian domestic law against foreigners in the Antarctic EEZ, based as it is on Australia’s claim to territorial sovereignty to the relevant part of Antarctica, can be “reasonably expected to prompt a significant adverse reaction from other Antarctic Treaty Parties”.


“reasonably expected to prompt a significant adverse reaction from other Antarctic Treaty Parties”

If the EEZ claim was legal, there would be no "adverse reaction" from the US, Russia, China, India, Japan etc.
 
Posts: 331 | Location (where you live): TIMOR-LESTE | Registered: 16 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Note this extract from an Australian Senate Hearing

quote:
Senator SIEWERT-Exactly. But that is not done when there are foreign vessels whaling in Australian waters.

Mr Campbell-If what you are suggesting is that Australian vessels that normally enforce fisheries laws do not enforce those laws in our proclaimed exclusive economic zone off the Australian Antarctic Territory, the answer is: yes, they do not board the vessels.

Senator SIEWERT-That is because those waters are not recognised internationally?

Mr Campbell-It is partly because relatively few countries recognise our sovereignty over the Australian Antarctic Territory and hence our sovereign rights over the adjacent waters, but also because of sensitivities within the Antarctic Treaty system.

Senator SIEWERT-What happens where those waters are near our bases? Are those waters recognised as our waters near our bases?

Mr Campbell-I think it comes back to the basic point that it is a question of recognition of our sovereignty over the Australian Antarctic Territory. Whilst Australia firmly believes that it has sovereignty over it, that is a view that is not shared by a lot of other countries.


"but also because of sensitivities within the Antarctic Treaty system"

The violation of the Antarctic treaty by making the EEZ claim is acknowledged openly in the Aussie Senate. The AG refers to it in his submission to the Federal Court.

Australia is unwilling to approach the ICJ, fearing an adverse ruling.

Australia is unwilling to enforce the judgments of its own courts regarding the EEZ it claims in ts own laws. Its own judges talk about futility.

It is clear to any sensible person that these are not Australian waters.
 
Posts: 331 | Location (where you live): TIMOR-LESTE | Registered: 16 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Cornell Law School Berger International Speaker Series

http://scholarship.law.cornell...&context=biss_papers

False Sanctuary: the Australian Antarctic Whale Sanctuary and Long-Term Stability in Antarctica
Donald K. Anton
Australian National University Law School
 
Posts: 331 | Location (where you live): TIMOR-LESTE | Registered: 16 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/pa...?abstract_id=1380122

Antarctic Whaling: Australia's Attempt to Protect Whales in the Southern Ocean

Donald K. Anton
University of Michigan - Law School; Australian National University - ANU College of Law
quote:
Textually, Article IV(2) has direct bearing on
the legality of Australia’s declaration of an Antarctic EEZ in 1994 and
enforcement of the Australian AWS under the EPBC Act. Specifically,
the treaty prohibits a state from asserting a “new claim, or enlargement
of an existing claim, to territorial sovereignty in Antarctica . . . .”133 The
effect “would seem to be that EEZs cannot be claimed off [Antarctic]
territory . . . .”134
quote:
In these cir****tances, it is difficult to characterize the declaration
of an EEZ, in Antarctica or elsewhere, as anything but a claim. The EEZ
did not exist in 1961 when the Antarctic Treaty came into force. Upon
its establishment, it did not automatically attach to a coastal state by
virtue of international law, as may be the case in connection with the
territorial sea141 or the contiguous zone.142 An EEZ is not created ipso
facto, but must be declared. Accordingly, under Article IV(2) of the
Antarctic Treaty it seems clear that the declaration of an EEZ is a
“claim” that is prohibited, provided the other conditions of the Article
are satisfied.
quote:
With the entry into force of Article IV of the Antarctic Treaty, a legal
bar to EEZ claims was established because such a claim would either
be a new claim or the enlargement of an existing claim.145
 
Posts: 331 | Location (where you live): TIMOR-LESTE | Registered: 16 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
A key objection to maritime claims to an EEZ in Antarctica relies
on the fact that under Article VI nothing in the Antarctic Treaty can
“prejudice or in any way affect the rights, or the exercise of the rights,
of any State under international law with regard to the high seas” in
Antarctica.164 A number of states maintain that this means all Antarctic
seas are to be considered high seas because there are no recognized
sovereign coastal states within the ATS.165 In other words, for the 187
states that do not recognise territorial claims in Antarctica, all marine
areas adjacent to Antarctica are high seas because there are no coastal
states.166
 
Posts: 331 | Location (where you live): TIMOR-LESTE | Registered: 16 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Under Article 4 of the Atnarctic Treaty. It nullifies Austrailia's EEZ claim under international law.

Which would mean Japan is not whaling in Austrailian waters, and therfore not "poaching" under Austrailian law. Japans is also completely legally killing whales for research. Because the Antarctic Treaty supercedes any claim by anyone, anywhere.

So if Austrailia wants the EEZ they would have to withdraw from the Antarctic Treaty System, if they even can.
 
Posts: 346 | Location (where you live): UNITED STATES | Registered: 24 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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That would trigger competing claims from nations far more powerful than Australia.

Both the US and the USSR reserved their rights to make Antarctic claims when they signed the treaty.

If the ATS collapses, then US, Russia, China, India, Japan etc all make territorial claims.
 
Posts: 331 | Location (where you live): TIMOR-LESTE | Registered: 16 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Ooooo...that would be fun!
I don't think Austrailia would pull out of it anyway. So Japan has nearly free reign and is 100% legal as it is now. So what happens with the SS will be very interesting. As far as registry revokation goes.
I wonder what the SS will do when that happens.
 
Posts: 346 | Location (where you live): UNITED STATES | Registered: 24 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by agni99:
This is Justice Alsop's ruling

http://www.hsi.org.au/editor/a...vs_Kyodo_FCA_664.pdf


I saw where you posted many more opinions from other sources. I'll look at them and comment at my leisure but since this ruling is the only one that has any legal standing vis a vis the Japanese whaling fleet, I will be responding to this after I have read it.

Have a good day.

quote:
"A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." - Mark Twain


"A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." - Mark Twain
 
Posts: 403 | Location (where you live): UNITED STATES | Registered: 13 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by agni99:
And this is the legal opinion of the Government of the United Kingdom as expressed to the House of Lords by the Minister

http://www.publications.parlia.../text/90304w0004.htm

Clearly, just like Japan, other countries do not recognize these waters as Australian.

And clearly the Japanese whaling is legal.


I read the entire section on the IWC. This was in no way a legal opinion. It was a question and answer session between Lord Ashcroft and Lord Hunt on changing the IWC charter. In no way did it deal with the Australian EEZ.


"A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." - Mark Twain
 
Posts: 403 | Location (where you live): UNITED STATES | Registered: 13 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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The Antarctic Treaty of 1959 states in:

Article 4 - the treaty does not recognize, dispute, nor establish territorial sovereignty claims; no new claims shall be asserted while the treaty is in force;

So under this treaty the EEZ is illegally claimed. Which was claimed well after the Antarctic Treaty was established. And only 4 countries recognize the claim under UNCLOS.
 
Posts: 346 | Location (where you live): UNITED STATES | Registered: 24 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by agni99:
This is Justice Alsop's ruling

http://www.hsi.org.au/editor/a...vs_Kyodo_FCA_664.pdf


Cheater, cheater! That was not the final ruling of the Australian Federal Court. The ruling cited above was from 27 May 2005 and was a ruling denying the HSI lawsuit against the Whalers in Japan.

Here is the link to the final ruling in this matter dated 15 January 2008:

http://www.hsi.org.au/editor/a...ment_15_Jan_2008.pdf

In part Justice Alsop writes on page 7 (page 9 in the PDF):

quote:
12 Australia’s claimed exclusive economic zone extends to the waters adjacent to the baseline of Australia’s external territories, including, importantly for this matter, the Australian Antarctic Territory. By virtue of the statutory definition in s 225 of the EPBC Act, the waters within 200 nautical miles from the Australian Antarctic Territory land mass are within the Australian Whale Sanctuary.


He goes on to talk about the results of his decision being overturned by the full court and the result (page 12 of the PDF:

quote:
20 Following the Full Court judgment, the applicant attempted, unsuccessfully, to serve the respondent in Japan via diplomatic channels. The Japanese Ministry of Foreign Affairs, in a note verbale dated 26 October 2006, refused to allow the documents to be accepted for service on the grounds that “this issue relates to waters and a matter over which Japan does not recognise Australia’s jurisdiction”. The applicant then filed a notice of motion on 31 January 2007, seeking substituted service upon the respondent in accordance with Order 7 rule 9 of the Federal Court Rules.


HSI tried mailing the documents to the Japanese company twice as well as delivering them in person. All attempts to serve the company were refused.

Here is what he said about JARPA, the organization granting the permits for the whale slaughter (page 15 of the PDF):

quote:
... JARPA is not a recognised foreign authority for the purposes of subsection 7(1) of the Antarctic Treaty (Environment Protection) Act 1980 (Cth).


His finding:

quote:
42 The respondent is the entity authorised by the Japanese Government to conduct the whaling. No direct evidence has been adduced to establish that the crews of the vessel were employees of the respondent. I infer, however, that the crews of the various vessels in the fleet were acting in accordance with the respondent’s authority, under JARPA and JARPA II.

43 Based on the facts outlined above, I am satisfied that the respondent is responsible for the actions of the whaling fleet for the purposes of the EPBC Act.

44 For the reasons already given in earlier reasons, I am satisfied that the EPBC Act applies to the Australian Whale Sanctuary and that there is no recognised foreign authority for the purposes of s 7(1) of the Antarctic Treaty (Environment Protection) Act 1980 (Cth). In reaching this latter conclusion, I have acted on the submissions and material put on by the applicant and the concession of the Attorney-General, both referred to at [40] of my reasons published on 27 May 2005 ([2005] FCA 664). Thus, I am satisfied that the respondent has contravened the EPBC Act, as alleged.


Japan is most definitely whaling in Australian waters!

He goes on to write about "futility" and the power of the Australian Federal Court to enforce its rulings on page 19 of the PDF:

quote:
47 In addition to paragraphs [14] – [16] of the majority judgment of the Full Court of this Court on appeal (excerpted above), Black CJ and Finkelstein J said the following on futility at [18] – [20]:

There is another way of considering the question of futility. The injunctive relief that the appellant seeks is relief by way of statutory injunction under s 475 of the EPBC Act. That section authorises the grant of what has been called a public interest injunction: see ICI Australia Operations Pty Ltd v TPC (1992) 38 FCR 248 at 256. Section 475 and the related provisions in Div 14 of Pt 17 of the EPBC Act have their counterpart in s 80 of the Trade Practices Act 1974 (Cth) (‘the TP Act’) upon which they appear to have been largely modelled.

Parliament has determined that it is in the public interest that the enforcement provisions of the EPBC Act should be unusually comprehensive in scope. Section 475 of the EPBC Act and its related provisions form part of a much larger enforcement scheme contained in the 21 divisions of Pt 17. The provisions include the conferral of powers of seizure and forfeiture, powers to board and detain vessels and authority to continue a pursuit on the high seas.

It is an important and distinctive feature of Div 14 of Pt 17 of the EPBC Act that, like s 80(4) of the TP Act, the Federal Court is expressly empowered to grant an injunction restraining a person from engaging in conduct whether or not it appears to the Court that the person intends to engage again in conduct of that kind and, even, whether or not there is a significant risk of injury or damage to the environment if the person engages


The ruling concludes on page 22 of the PDF:

quote:
54 On the material placed before the Court, I am satisfied that the respondent has contravened ss 229, 229A, 229B, 229C, 229D and 230 of the EPBC Act in relation to Antarctic minke whales and fin whales by killing, injuring, taking and interfering with them and the treating and possessing of them and by injuring, interfering with and treating and possessing humpback whales and that, unless restrained, it will continue to kill, injure, take and interfere with them, and treat and possess them.

55 In all the cir****tances, the orders of the Court will be:

1. The Court declares that the respondent has killed, injured, taken and interfered with Antarctic minke whales (Balaenoptera bonaerensis) and fin whales (Balaenoptera physalus) and injured, taken and interfered with humpback whales (Megaptera novaeangliae) in the Australian Whale Sanctuary in contravention of sections 229, 229A, 229B and 229C of the Environment Protection and Biodiversity Conservation Act 1999 (Cth), (the “Act”), and has treated and possessed such whales killed or taken in the Australian Whale Sanctuary in contravention of sections 229D and 230 of the Act, without permission or authorisation under sections 231, 232 or 238 of the Act.

2. The Court orders that the respondent be restrained from killing, injuring, taking or interfering with any Antarctic minke whale (Balaenoptera bonaerensis), fin whale (Balaenoptera physalus) or humpback whale (Megaptera novaeangliae) in the Australian Whale Sanctuary, or treating or possessing any such whale killed or taken in the Australian Whale Sanctuary, unless permitted or authorised under sections 231, 232 or 238 of the Environment Protection and Biodiversity Conservation Act 1999 (Cth).


I like the part where he orders the Japanese whalers "be restrained"... The Sea Shepherd prop foulers work for me. Should slow the pirates down until the Australian Coast Guard arrives.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: nbrownfzi,


"A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." - Mark Twain
 
Posts: 403 | Location (where you live): UNITED STATES | Registered: 13 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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so, Australia should dispatch navy?

Incidentally, if Ross Sea was AUS territory contrary to the fact), Aus should go arrest Sea Shepherd for illegally ramming ships, throwing chemicals, sailing a ship without a certified captain, etc.
 
Posts: 263 | Location (where you live): UNITED KINGDOM | Registered: 18 May 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by antiantiwhaler:
so, Australia should dispatch navy?


Only peaceful military operations in the Antarctic area are permitted under Article 1 of the Antarctic Treaty. Under the UNCLOS, only a warship can seize the Nishin Maru and they can't fire a shot across the bow of the Nishin Maru while in the ATS area or send over a boarding party because both acts are decidedly not peaceful.

They can, however, trail the Japanese fleet until they reach international waters outside the Treaty zone and then order them to heave to and surrender.


"A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." - Mark Twain
 
Posts: 403 | Location (where you live): UNITED STATES | Registered: 13 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Australia may claim those waters.

Just as Somalia or Vanuatu or Panama may claim those waters.

The fact remains that the rest of the world considers them international waters and under the Antarctic treaty these additional EEZ claims are prohibited.

Australia may as well claim the moon. That is prohibited by treaty but Australia could ignore this as they ignore the AT.

Any reasonable person can judge the validity of this claim by the actions of Australia.

Not a single filing to the International Court of Justice.

Not a move to prevent access to the purported EEZ, something every other state does.

If these are Australian waters, then file a motion in the courts to compel the Australian government to enforce their laws.

Or is Australia little better than Somalia?
 
Posts: 331 | Location (where you live): TIMOR-LESTE | Registered: 16 August 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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